Cheating

[FoxIllusionTen]

it wouldnt be an unfair advantage beause most if not all smashers are aware of it. Some just choose not to use it. Its their choice. Nintendo didnt choose to do anything about people l canceling and wavedashing.

In tornaments, you wouldnt go very far not knowing of l cancing and all. After you had lost and had seen the moves, if you cared at all about doing better, the least you wouldve done was reserch it and find out, thereby if not to use it, they would be aware of it. That way, knowledge of this spreads everywhere. So how do u call it an unfair advantage? everyone knows or can find out, they just choose not to.

This kind of stuff is nessacary in tourneys, i have not seen a single winner or good placer that has not utilized l cancel or wavedash at one point or another. However, if you jut play for fun like shadow here, that is not all that required. Among freinds, you can outlaw it and make the playing stage level for those wh have not entered competitive playing. A person in this situation that cheats is truely a sad sad individual. The least they could do was to make others aware.

I not under any circumstance would pull and "cheats" on my friends, seeing as how they have enough trouble dealing with me even without l cancel. Just to make it clear, i am not a cheat protagonist, i do not at anyway support cheating. How i see it, SSBM is an exception. You enter tourneys to catch up on new strats and tactics, as well as to have fun and ultimately, win. If you see l canceling, thats something you would regard as a new style in playing. Therefore, im almost SURE that everyone in competative playing has at least HEARD and or seen l cancel and all that stuff. If they choose to neglect it, then, u cant say it was an unfair advantage. That would be like not studying for a test and then you start complaining that it was unfair and u didnt know about it after you recieve an F.

Bottom line: Lcancel, wavedash is considered cheating, however, almost mandatory in competative play. Use of it for amusemant, fun with friends, oblivious others, well, thats all it is there, cheating.

[Sepharite]

Personally, I care and don't care about cheating. First, of course, using another technique outside the original game (often described as a cheat) is just wrong because it shows the lack of skill the player has, that they have to resort to cheating. But really, cheating on videogames is quite different from cheating in the real world so I don't really mind.

And welcome to the forum, Fox!

edit: Damn, everyone already said it already.... guess I should read other's post before posting ><

[FoxIllusionTen]

thanks

but, in SSBM, the weird thing is, you can only use those "cheats" if you have enough skill. If youre a weak player, then theres no way that l canceling and wavedashing is gonna help, in fact, more thanlikely, the attention to them forse worse gameplay. You see, the difference here is that these "cheats" can only help those who have played fair enough that they are well skilled far beyond the norm.

[ShadowMarth]

Not only is that completely beside the point, but it's just another change of stance from you. It's cheating, you agreed yourself. Once that is known, there is NO WAY to justify it. At all. You can repeat tired old excuses, you can change them mid-argument, but it doesn't matter, it's still cheating.

[FoxIllusionTen]

alright, we know that its cheating, so whats the argument then? Im saying, that wave and l cancel is on a tier below cheating, it is somewhat less than that, its not fully cheating because like dsduse said, cheating is partially decieving. Were not decieving anyone here like i said in a previous post.

By the way, theyre all from the same stance, those are just the numerouse reasons that L cancel and wavedash stands out from the crowd of cheats, secrets, glitches. So in a sense, its not cheating but if you look from another point, one can see it as just another glitch in a faulted game.

[ShadowMarth]

It's cheating. There's no tiers involved. That's annother idiotic rationalization.

a few years ago, i used to cheat all the time. but then i learned that cheating makes the game less fun. seriously, play starcraft with cheats and win, and then play it without cheats and win. there is a huge difference. (but thats just single player)

yea multiplayer cheating is gay. so is using little glitches to your advantage(in multiplayer).

play the game the way it was meant to be played, its just better that way

[FoxIllusionTen]

yes, i do understand that fact. Its different in tournament play though, SSBM. Everyone does it there and it serves to improve their game. It seems the only way to win is to use l cancel as well. A tournament is to show whos the best, have fun, all that stuff. If you satnd by the ethic that you dont want to l cancel, then even if youre the number one player, the 2nd ranked one can easily overtake you with l cancel and stuff. I cant explait in words, you have to enter a tourney and know what it takes to rank high. Im sure high rankers went through his process of weighing out the ethics to the cause.

I sure dont enjoy cheating, ive played starcraft as well, i hate it when people hack to win and dont play fair. Its different SSBM wise. It takes a hard core SSBM fan to know that l cancel and wave is nessacary. To amatuers, this may not seem fair. In competition, it is simply needed. Ive said before, when i have the choice not to use it, i dont.

[FoxIllusionTen]

people are just posting experiences with other games. Its different with SSBM, this is why i suggested we debate at smashboards.

Mormon, ive played stracraft many times, enough to understand that cheating can be the mosr irritating shots during a game. I dont use them either, except maybe on that one campaign mission...

[ShadowMarth]

No, SSBM is no different. Just because people do it there, as apposed to the rest of the gaming community, means that they're all wrong, not that we are. Yes, tournament play should be considered different, but opposed to what you say, the rules should be more strict, not less.