Nintendo DS to Include the Palm OS?

[Luineancaion]

Well if they just ported over the main tools and gave us some kind of device that could be written to then it'd be easy to port a browser over, though I wouldn't use firefox as that would need way to much ram, maybe one of the text based browsers with image support, or someone could even write a very minimal browser. There would be so much that could be done with this, but it is first of all a games device.

[x999x]

Luineancaion- It's not by choice, you're talking to a Mac convert here. When I moved over from print to web, it was only natural I switch to a PC. They're so cheap these days, I've put all my iMacs into the closet and only pull them out when I absolutely need them.

On the subject of outlook, again, this is dictated by work. My office uses the entire microsoft suite to organize, track, and maintain our workflow with dot.project and the like. Show me a GNU alternative that's not star office, is 100% compatible with my work's software, and I'll gladly switch.

I like open source projects, just not when it comes to personal information, especially it's management.

Lastly, it's not pheasible for Ninty to use any facet of linux on the DS for a number of reasons. Firstly, unless it's a stand alone appliance, you're not going to be syncing with anything unless you also run a linux work station, Sharp Zaurus anyone? Furthermore, there's the lingering issue of Microsoft holding a fist full of law suits against linux as a whole for infringing upon what it considers many of it's patents that are quite impossible to get around without altering the entire GUI process. Mac stole their OS from Xerox, the same people MS did, so they're not likely to sue Apple, especially since they own part of it now. Anyway, my point is, if MS sees a potential revenue loss with linux being distributed to the mainstream like this, I think Ninty would have a real calamity on their hands if say they licensed copies of RedHat to run on a GBA card and used the same patent infringing features microsoft is upset about. This is a long shot, but a very probable "con" that was on the drawing board as to how to further enable the DS using a licensed OS.

Baronen- Sorry to spoil the party, it's just that I am an avid PocketPC user, and having migrated from a Palm IIe all the ways to the latest iPAQ, I've seen the industry and it's software evolve into what it is today.

That said, one point I want everyone to understand is HOW LIMITED MOBILE WEB BROWSING IS. Don't expect any mini firefoxes, internet explorers, or mozillas... On my PocketPC which is significantly more powerful than the DS, even it's browsing is limited to what it can display.

Some reasons as to why mobile browsing is so hard to accomplish:

1- Available memory. This is the largest problem, and will limit browsing to a very basic text and image experience. No animated gifs (not on ds at least), no flash movies, etc. Any server side scripting will still be possible, like posting on php boards liek this.

2- No Java support. As little as it's used nowadays, you'd still be suprised as to how many sites use some sort of java to up the ante on security, or offer a better browsing experience. For example, gmail uses a java box for the login box. A pocketPC cannot interpret this, and therefore you can't log into gmail using a browser, but need to port foward it to a conduit application. Java on the pocketPC is a mini-java engine, it handles light workloads, and requires 2 megs of program space to run. Cutting the DS's ram in half for java support is not likely to happen.

3- Flash, swf movies. There is limited support on mobile devices for flash, however it only supports up to flash 5, which is powerful, but not as powerful as 7 (MX), which a number of games and web applications are made from. In other words, I can't even browse my own site on my PocketPC, no chance the DS ever will.

4- Browsers... Currently, MiniMO is in the works, but it's very limited. NetFront 2.1 is the current leader with the most support for offering an "almost" PC-like experience. It handles light java, javascripting, and soon, xml/rss feeds. Pocket Internet Explorer comes in second, and since it's by microsoft, don't count on ever seeing it on the DS. There is no pocket-Firefox, and if there was, it'd be MiniMo (mini mozilla), so again, any web browsing alternatives for the DS are not possible.

In Conclusion:

I would like to see the DS offer linux as it's OS only for what the Homebrew community could do with it at that point, similar to NetYaroze for the PS One. I highly doubt Ninty will go this route for reasons I've already discussed, but if it did make it to the DS, all of my points I've illustrated as "problems" would vanish with the advent of one simple process, Remote Desktop Sessions. TightVNC can run a footprint in kilobytes, and essentially display what's on your computer's desktop. Interacting with your DS manipulates the mouse on your comptuer, so in essence, you could still use your computer just like you were really there. This means you can browse the web using a real browser, check emails, even use programs that don't need a lot of speed. I use this alternative on my PocketPC for remote administration like rebooting my computer at home, or changing the channel on my tvtuner so I can serve up something to watch on my pocketPC while at work with a wifi connection ;)

IM SERIOUS ABOUT PDAS, COULD YOU TELL?

[Luineancaion]

Well I'm not really sure about free-software for windows? But kmail is good, I hear that evolution is being ported to windows so that could be good?

Microsofts patents are BS and even you must know that, if they tried pushing those in court it'd get thrown out, there are big companys behind GNU/Linux, IBM is the biggest, then there are companys like sun, oracle, HP and then lots of other smaller companys.

MS would never be able to sue over something like using scrollbars inside a window, it's just all MS fud, they also have problems with being a monopoly which would stop them from that kind of thing.

Also their patents are worthless in Europe, atleast at the moment.

By the way, what's wrong with open office? I hear that ximians version of it is very good, there is also kmail, but again that's a kde thing, though kde should soon be up and running on windows as trolltech have released their windows build of the library under the GPL.

Also as a mac guy, how come you haven't gotten yourself a mac mini? :P I hear that they are great, and the sure look nice :)

I don't think I'd trust MS software when it comes to personal information.

I also thought that the Zarius had problems syncing with a GNU/Linux machine but could sync easily with windows, probably because Sharp made some proprietry software for windows made to sync with the zarius.

If nintendo ported GNU/Linux over to the DS then we would just have another big company backing GNU/Linux, also Sony use GNU/Linux and netbsd in their products, MS can't do a thing, they just go around spreading FUD. (Fear uncertianity & doubt)

[x999x]

I agree with a lot of what you say, but some of the MS stuff is where I differ. Something I know first hand, is MS' legal department. A company I once worked for was forced to file bankruptcy because MS kept pursuing legal action, one after another, for a matter than had happened years before under different ownership. Needless to say, they have endless pockets, and in a full fledged no holds barred legal fight, MS has the financial power to win regardless of the court's verdict. You should know this first hand having seen MS' monopoly problems get settled in europe... Seems like they just HELPED MS in the process... doh! My point being, yes, MS could and will sue if they feel like it, no matter who it is, because neither company is run soley by a nerd with small man's complex and bottomless pockets.

Regarding open office and the like, you exemplified my precise problem with the whole open source project, and that's having multiple versions of the same application, similar to the many different flavors of linux. I shouldn't have to be than "in" to my OS to "be in the know" if you catch my drift. That's not to say it doesn't work for everyone else, heck if I were a programmer, I'd definately be on a unix based OS, but I'm not, I'm an art guy who needs buttons and layer upon layer of screen prompts to get by.

I stopped doing the mac thing a while ago. Minimac looks nice, but I think they sold themself short by not matching it's creative style to the accesories you'll have to use with it, i.e. a monitor, keyboard and mouse. Their recommended accessories don't compliment the minimac in the way other apple machine's accesories have in the past. Take the "G" series for example, it's clear case and accessories started a fashion statement in electronics. In any case, they woulda had me if it had an attachable mini high definition lcd screen, along with a battery pack that rests underneath to make it a mobile work station. Similar to what the OQO is, if you check out oqo.com.

[Luineancaion]

Governments rely to much on Unix and GNU/Linux, MS would never be able to sue, and there is really no-one worth suing because no-one owns GNU/Linux. MS target companys like IBM, but that won't stop development, though it could make companys like Nintendo feel threatened.

[17R3W]

http://ds.ign.com/articles/586/586895p1.html

Could V-pocket have anything to do with this?????

[x999x]

Not all governments rely on gnu/linux for it's open sourced security reasons. MS also owns most of the business sector, but that's beside the point right now, the gist of it is, MS flexes and people back off, just like potential bandwagoneers like Ninty.

Nice find 17R3W, it very well could pertain to some PIM addon for the DS, or something else entirely. The only reason I say that is because V doesn't really apply to PIM as well as it could. V could stand for voice, which would make the DS a sort of free cellphone device if u'r at a hotspot, similar to telephony maybe? :)

[Darkmatter]

virtual pocket may be

ds with full internet capabilities ie internt exploreer cart something like that

[Luineancaion]

If the DS gets internet explorer I'll kick that cartridge into the ocean.

Seriously use something better like firefox www.mozilla.org internet explorer is the main reason you get spyware.

[x999x]

Well, no matter what they use for web on the ds, it's still going to not be any better than WAP browsing :T